Episode 155 features the return of the original Palmer Files guest Bill Sweeney. He’s back to tackle some of Proust’s Questionnaire. And aside from explaining what this isn’t, we’ll discuss Skype, basements and attics, poetry, the flow state, and much much more.
Mentioned and Helpful Links from This Episode
What is the Proust Questionnaire?
Other Links
Casthen Gain expands Hansen’s epic worldbuilding started in Graven Trilogy
Palmer’s 2025 Tour de France Recap
Special Guest Executive Producer: Bill Sweeney
Music created and provided by Henno Heitur of Monkey Tongue Productions.
–End Show Notes Transmission–
–Begin Transcription–
00:00:00:01 – 00:00:26:26
Agent Palmer
Previously on Agent Palmer dot com. I recap the 2025 tour de France. Casting gain expands Hanson’s epic Graven world, and I may have to get some lessons from Bryan to better keep the beat. This is The Palmer Files episode 155. With the return of the original Palmer Files guest Bill Sweeney, he’s back to tackle some of Proust’s questionnaire. And aside from explaining what this isn’t, we’ll discuss Skype, basements and attics, poetry, the flow state, and much, much more.
00:00:26:31 – 00:00:58:48
Agent Palmer
Are you ready? Let’s do the show.
00:00:58:53 – 00:01:27:00
Agent Palmer
Hello, and welcome to The Palmer Files. I’m your host, Jason Stershic, also known as Agent Palmer. And on this 155th episode is my friend Bill Sweeney. Bill is back after a very long time, having not appeared on the show since episode 101. But what is this? What has he returned for? This is a series of episodes that will be released over the course of the next few months where my friends, specifically those from the friendship episodes, get to come on the show and ask me a select few questions from Proust Questionnaire.
00:01:27:05 – 00:01:48:52
Agent Palmer
The first one with Chris Maier was episode 152. There are 17 questions. Bill is going second, so he gets to choose from what remains. Chris only used three, so there’s still plenty to choose from. Coming soon will be Chris Hughes, then Jason Zapata, and who knows what happens with the remainder of the questions at this time. A link to the questionnaire Wikipedia entry is in the show notes.
00:01:48:56 – 00:02:08:35
Agent Palmer
If you want a history lesson. I won’t spoil which questions Bill asks, but know that we talk about the end of the road for Skype. Discuss basements and attics and how everyone is weird. Plus is poetry a young man’s game? Clive Barker, preacher and Bill has more TV pitches than a Hollywood waiter. All of this and much, much more is coming your way shortly.
00:02:08:36 – 00:02:26:06
Agent Palmer
But first, remember that if you want to discuss this episode as you listen or afterwards, you can find all related ways to contact Bill and myself in the show notes. I highly suggest you check out Wicked theory.com to see what Bill may or may not be up to. Don’t forget, you can see all of my writings and rantings on Agent palmer.com.
00:02:26:06 – 00:02:38:04
Agent Palmer
And of course email can be sent to the Palmer files at gmail.com. So without further ado, let’s get into it.
00:02:38:09 – 00:02:57:25
Agent Palmer
Bill, welcome back to the show. You were in the lead as far as like, return appearances over and over again, but you are only the second fifth timer. You didn’t get there first. What? What? I know, I know, so.
00:02:57:30 – 00:02:59:11
Bill Sweeney
And this one doesn’t put me.
00:02:59:24 – 00:03:07:17
Agent Palmer
This one puts you at the top. You are now tied back. You are the second, fifth, fifth. Fifth time, five time guest.
00:03:07:22 – 00:03:09:26
Bill Sweeney
Oh, this is like SNL with the five timers club.
00:03:09:40 – 00:03:10:55
Agent Palmer
I guess. Yeah.
00:03:10:59 – 00:03:22:43
Bill Sweeney
All right, all right, I can deal with that. Yeah. I mean, you know, I’m not, you know, happy that, you know, I was, dethroned there for a minute, but, you.
00:03:22:43 – 00:03:38:07
Agent Palmer
Know, I you know what? You know what it was? I married a podcaster, and when we told our stories, right about the relationship and the baby, we ended up doing two episodes apiece for those, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So she bolted ahead real quick.
00:03:38:09 – 00:03:47:53
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, well, the math adds up. And as anybody who knows me knows, math has never been my friend. So it’s not a surprise. That and something.
00:03:47:53 – 00:03:50:26
Agent Palmer
Very important that we need to do right off the bat.
00:03:50:31 – 00:03:50:56
Bill Sweeney
Okay.
00:03:51:00 – 00:03:54:49
Agent Palmer
This is not the last episode of the Palmer Files.
00:03:54:54 – 00:03:58:19
Bill Sweeney
Oh, true. Yes, yes. This does not count. No.
00:03:58:24 – 00:04:07:25
Agent Palmer
No, because Bill will be hopefully, you know, if I ever end this thing. The last guest. But that will not be tonight.
00:04:07:31 – 00:04:12:35
Bill Sweeney
And the ending comes with a certain amount of planning and not some just sudden, abrupt start.
00:04:12:40 – 00:04:17:16
Agent Palmer
Hoo hoo. No, I mean stop. I don’t. Yeah. I mean, who knows?
00:04:17:21 – 00:04:19:37
Bill Sweeney
You’ll just have to tune in to find out, folks.
00:04:19:41 – 00:04:32:40
Agent Palmer
Yeah. Look, it’s been a while since we have done this, for real. And, we are doing it on a very auspicious, evening.
00:04:32:45 – 00:04:33:12
Bill Sweeney
Is it?
00:04:33:16 – 00:04:35:27
Agent Palmer
Yeah, we we are, we are.
00:04:35:29 – 00:04:40:01
Bill Sweeney
Do we do we wait. Do we need to look that up? Auspicious. Auspicious.
00:04:40:05 – 00:04:41:30
Agent Palmer
I mean, I, I know what it.
00:04:41:30 – 00:04:45:13
Bill Sweeney
Means, but. Yeah. Okay. Okay, okay.
00:04:45:18 – 00:04:49:02
Agent Palmer
Well, can I, can I explain what the is like?
00:04:49:07 – 00:04:50:22
Bill Sweeney
Yes, please. I did cut you off.
00:04:50:24 – 00:04:56:27
Agent Palmer
Yeah. I mean, if I say something after this and it’s like, well, it was a day ending, and why not auspicious.
00:04:56:29 – 00:04:57:54
Bill Sweeney
You’re right, you’re right.
00:04:57:59 – 00:05:12:31
Agent Palmer
This is the last episode of The Palmer Files to be recorded on Skype. This is probably one of the last podcasts ever to be recorded on Skype, because Skype shuts down in, like, a matter of hours at this point.
00:05:12:46 – 00:05:14:48
Bill Sweeney
It’s at the end of an era.
00:05:14:53 – 00:05:18:39
Agent Palmer
And this I only bring it up because this is how.
00:05:18:43 – 00:05:41:26
Bill Sweeney
Well, first of all, let me just say that how apropos is this, that this is the first time I’ve used Skype with zero issues. I opened it up. I didn’t have to do a login stuff. My mic set up was like, one, two, three. No, like, oh, which settings, which buttons, which headphone jack? None of that. It was like, oh well, I select done.
00:05:41:35 – 00:05:43:22
Agent Palmer
They finally figured it out.
00:05:43:27 – 00:05:44:01
Bill Sweeney
Just in.
00:05:44:01 – 00:06:05:10
Agent Palmer
Time. Just in time. And look like until, the trip to Michigan and your, adventure here and your 200th episode. Right? We were Skype friends for a very long time like that. That was the main. This. This was our main platform build.
00:06:05:11 – 00:06:13:16
Bill Sweeney
This. This was one of. Yeah. We it was probably like a 5050. Like we were on Skype as much as we were on a phone.
00:06:13:18 – 00:06:13:48
Agent Palmer
That’s true.
00:06:13:50 – 00:06:26:18
Bill Sweeney
And and we were in quite the regular contact. So. Yeah. Yeah. These days not so much. We’re older, wiser. We don’t need each other’s crap. You know what I mean?
00:06:26:24 – 00:06:32:17
Agent Palmer
Is it, is it are we wiser? I’ll ask. I have no shame anymore.
00:06:32:22 – 00:06:41:31
Bill Sweeney
Well, you’re wise enough to know. That’s probably bullshit. So there’s something. You’re wise enough to know that that can’t be right.
00:06:41:35 – 00:07:01:21
Agent Palmer
Look, I, I, this is also the first time, which is odd for, like, my close friends, but, like, I guess it would have had to have been a moment at some point. Like, this is the first time I’m recording with you from the new basement studio. And.
00:07:01:26 – 00:07:08:46
Bill Sweeney
Just let me tell you folks, it is a basement studio for what I can see. Just let your imagination go wild with that.
00:07:08:51 – 00:07:29:56
Agent Palmer
Yeah. Well, if, if, if I, I did in real life like I do have like a, an in person studio to my left, kind of where I can sit across from a guest. And I invited someone over, like a local friend who’s going to be on the show at some point or who may have been on already.
00:07:29:56 – 00:07:32:02
Agent Palmer
I don’t know what the source of anything.
00:07:32:02 – 00:07:33:36
Bill Sweeney
Who knows? Who knows?
00:07:33:41 – 00:07:40:52
Agent Palmer
And Steph goes, but you’re not going to invite them down into the basement, right? You’re going to just tell them to come over.
00:07:40:57 – 00:07:44:30
Bill Sweeney
Because there’s work to do down there. Still, I think, honey.
00:07:44:35 – 00:07:51:28
Agent Palmer
I mean, it is unfinished, I think would be a good, descriptor of this basement.
00:07:51:32 – 00:08:12:11
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, but let me tell you something. Well, as soon as someone says, hey, we got to go, let’s go downstairs to the basement, like, all my expectations go out the window, right? Like it could be basement, you know, stone walls, raw foundation and, a water heater and two folding chairs. You know what I mean? Serial killer style.
00:08:12:22 – 00:08:18:43
Bill Sweeney
Or, like, completely done over. But you just don’t know until you get down there. Generally speaking, what’s your enforce?
00:08:18:43 – 00:08:19:34
Agent Palmer
And this is.
00:08:19:39 – 00:08:22:14
Bill Sweeney
This doesn’t look bad. This is like middle of the road. What I would expect.
00:08:22:17 – 00:08:48:12
Agent Palmer
That’s that’s fair. And this is this is fun because Steph and I were talking, as we were walking around the neighborhood recently about, like, like, what’s a basement? What’s an attic? Because there was a third floor in Phoenix, necessarily, or a second floor in Phoenix, but there wasn’t like an attic. Attic? Like. Right. Like like the equivalent of what I’m sitting in, but like, just on top of the house, right where you see the exposed beams from underneath the roof.
00:08:48:16 – 00:09:09:37
Agent Palmer
And so I was like, but what about like, basements? And it’s like, well, out west, we don’t really do basements. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so I think this might be us being very, regional that we’re like, well, we’ve been in a lot of different kinds of beat because, because, like you, it’s very much like I’m like, like, I’m not that tall.
00:09:09:37 – 00:09:16:02
Agent Palmer
You’re taller than me, but, like, I’m not that tall, like, and every time somebody is like, well, come on down, I’m like, am I going to have to.
00:09:16:16 – 00:09:17:57
Bill Sweeney
Like, get.
00:09:18:02 – 00:09:21:22
Agent Palmer
Like, scrunched down? Like, will I be able to stand up?
00:09:21:27 – 00:09:52:08
Bill Sweeney
Is this just a crawl space with a table? Like, what are we heading? Yeah. And that’s what I feel like with attics too, when people are like, oh, it’s up in the attic. And like, as lucky as I am, the house I grew up in was fairly large and it had a massive attic, like the attic was always like a giant space that we were like ready to like, oh my God, if we could get this redone, we would have like the equivalent of like five master bedrooms up here versus a friend’s attic, quote unquote, which was literally you pull down the stairs on a string and like, watch your head immediately.
00:09:52:08 – 00:09:56:22
Bill Sweeney
We have to squat to walk around. Now it’s just did you like 15 boxes?
00:09:56:22 – 00:10:00:43
Agent Palmer
Did you have to walk on the joists? Or you would put your foot through the ceiling?
00:10:00:48 – 00:10:27:04
Bill Sweeney
Funny enough, he didn’t have to. But there were spots where like because my dad had done work and the rooms below dropped like cable through and stuff like that, that some of those boards came up and didn’t get put back and my brother Dave was up there lifting weights and took a step back, and he went one leg straight into my parents closet and fucking probably smashed up his testes in the process.
00:10:27:09 – 00:10:36:32
Bill Sweeney
If I remember correctly, he was like a teenager. I mean, I remember hearing the noise downstairs. I mean, my dad was like, what the hell was that?
00:10:36:37 – 00:10:44:16
Agent Palmer
The and I can only imagine the noise because it would have been muffled if it if it, if it arrived in a closet. So it’s not like a normal.
00:10:44:21 – 00:11:05:14
Bill Sweeney
We were in the living room. It was a second floor closet. You know what I mean? Like two rooms over above. And it just sounded like. Did someone kick a door in, like, next door? Like, what was that you can hear? That’s one of the best stories. One of the, you know, had to be there, but, like, you know, nothing good ever happened in the attic.
00:11:05:14 – 00:11:06:51
Bill Sweeney
And we will move on. We’ll just leave, okay?
00:11:06:51 – 00:11:30:59
Agent Palmer
That’s fair, that’s fair. I had an attic like that. That was then finished. At one point, into two rooms. And like, the only thing I will say is because that became my my room up there in the attic, it was fine. But you I had to get used to hearing bats, just like it was finished.
00:11:30:59 – 00:11:48:09
Agent Palmer
Like the part I was in was finished and it was finished. Like, to within, like, you know, there were, like, diagonal walls, you know, so they went as far as they could, but there was still access from the outside to the other side of those walls. Yeah. So you would hear.
00:11:48:13 – 00:11:51:05
Bill Sweeney
Eaves like squirrels would get in bats. Yeah, sure.
00:11:51:13 – 00:12:08:18
Agent Palmer
But it was always bats. You could hear them just like moving around and like you just had to get used to it. Which is why for a long period of time, maybe like from the first summer I was in that room until like, I don’t know, sometime after college, I always slept with music on.
00:12:08:22 – 00:12:10:00
Bill Sweeney
Because the bats would keep you out just to.
00:12:10:00 – 00:12:16:41
Agent Palmer
Drown it out. Like, yeah, yeah, I never gave myself the opportunity to get used to it because I was like, I’m never getting used to this.
00:12:16:41 – 00:12:23:57
Bill Sweeney
That’s listening to K 106.9 all night long.
00:12:24:02 – 00:12:27:30
Agent Palmer
Yeah. Or whatever. Like it was just it was they got see.
00:12:27:36 – 00:12:32:34
Bill Sweeney
Each one once one Tom petty CD on loop for eight hours of sleep.
00:12:32:36 – 00:12:54:18
Agent Palmer
No because I, I mean, we talk about like the technology of the day. I had an advanced stereo system that I could shuffle the three CD’s in my CD changer. Now, it would take a minute between each song, but it was loud enough when it d selected a CD, turned the turntable inside and.
00:12:54:23 – 00:13:08:49
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, almost wasn’t worth it, brother. It’s like waiting for a jukebox to make another track. You’re Levine, it’s like you can hear the machine whirring and it’s pulling it out. It’s like, no, I want the tracks on the disk to shuffle and then we go to another disk. Can we do that?
00:13:08:54 – 00:13:19:49
Agent Palmer
I think, I think I could, but I think for some reason I chose the, the I don’t know, I was like, it’s if it’s if it’s not clear already. Yeah. I was a weird kid.
00:13:19:54 – 00:13:24:41
Bill Sweeney
I mean, folks, if you haven’t figured this out by this episode, I just at least had an inkling I.
00:13:24:41 – 00:13:31:37
Agent Palmer
Right? Although the same is probably true of like anyone who has a podcast that survives.
00:13:31:42 – 00:13:59:07
Bill Sweeney
Well, let’s just put it like this. Everybody’s a weirdo until it, like, they hit like 20, I don’t know, I was scrambling for an age in my head. That’s 12. No, it’s some weird shit at 12. What about 14? Yeah, I guess 14. 20, 20 seems low. A lot of 14. You start to think like you’re cooler than you are, like to a degree, but like, you know, I don’t know because I’m just thinking, like, the really weird shit when you’re a little kid and like, you don’t really.
00:13:59:12 – 00:14:02:58
Bill Sweeney
I guess you care what other kids are going to say I make fun of you about, but like, you don’t.
00:14:03:03 – 00:14:03:55
Agent Palmer
But that’s all.
00:14:03:55 – 00:14:07:20
Bill Sweeney
That’s it does. Your brain doesn’t catch that before you do the thing yet, and.
00:14:07:20 – 00:14:33:47
Agent Palmer
It’s also a very much, like at that time there’s a with people and without people and you don’t have control over it. You’re there at school or at daycare or preschool or whatever. Yeah. Or you’re at home, right? And even with brothers, it’s very much, like, this is the stuff we do in our house. And sometimes, like the filter of we don’t do that in public, just doesn’t exist.
00:14:33:51 – 00:14:50:44
Bill Sweeney
Well, nothing ever would reveal to you how specifically maybe weird or whatever, like your house was by going to someone else’s house for an extended like. Like an overnight stay or just like, oh, I was you know, with Jimmy and his family for like, long hours one day, like, we went to the park and we went, you know what I mean?
00:14:50:44 – 00:15:10:43
Bill Sweeney
But whatever. But, like, you should just see, like, all their little rules and, like, little weirdness and like, oh, shit. Okay. All right. We’re weird, like, in this way, but you guys are fucking really weird, like, you know, and they’re not like, they leave, like, you know, certain drinks on the counter, they don’t put the condiments in the refrigerator or some shit.
00:15:10:43 – 00:15:18:06
Bill Sweeney
And I’m like, you guys are crazy. I mean, it’s like, no, kid, it’s not that big a deal.
00:15:18:11 – 00:15:40:43
Agent Palmer
My favorite was growing up. My favorite was the bread because, like, some people have a bread box, some people keep bread on the counter, some people put it in the fridge. And I think having tried, bread, but, like a, a bread tried in a pan. Whatever.
00:15:40:49 – 00:15:43:29
Bill Sweeney
Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Tried. Breadcrumb. Yeah.
00:15:43:34 – 00:15:57:56
Agent Palmer
It just got moldy and I was like, I guess I’m either not getting the right kind of bread a or B, I’m not eating it fast enough. Yeah. For to, for this to use. And I was like, why, every time I use this it gets moldy.
00:15:58:01 – 00:16:04:35
Bill Sweeney
Well, thanks to the internet, you can look up an article for each one of those ways to do it. And each one of those will tell you.
00:16:04:35 – 00:16:05:21
Agent Palmer
It’s the best.
00:16:05:34 – 00:16:16:03
Bill Sweeney
That’s the right way, and you can find it. One article to tell you it’s the wrong way. So just like everything else you nowadays, there’s no right. And by the way, I used to stick with what works.
00:16:16:03 – 00:16:31:46
Agent Palmer
Did I did I, I was very excited when I found this out. Did I tell you how to get rid of at the at the time of recording? This still works. I’m sure Google would prefer otherwise. Did I tell you how to get rid of I results from Google searches?
00:16:31:46 – 00:16:39:04
Bill Sweeney
I forget what it was, but I did see it somewhere. Yeah, I did see somebody was like, oh, just do this and this. And like, you don’t have to see any of that.
00:16:39:06 – 00:16:49:25
Agent Palmer
All you have to do is put a curse, right. You put fuck in front of whatever your query or search is. For some reason.
00:16:49:30 – 00:16:52:28
Bill Sweeney
I like we don’t do we don’t do that.
00:16:52:30 – 00:17:00:03
Agent Palmer
Right. Somehow I is very polite, or at least somehow, like, they don’t like that word, right?
00:17:00:03 – 00:17:14:59
Bill Sweeney
Right, right. With all of the filters just kind of set up to react in a certain way. That’s just like, we don’t do any work for you now. Like, you know, we just we refuse to entertain your silliness. 12 year old.
00:17:15:09 – 00:17:22:00
Agent Palmer
Well, I’m glad you bring that up, because entertaining silliness is kind of the thing that, like you and I started with.
00:17:22:05 – 00:17:23:05
Bill Sweeney
Sure.
00:17:23:10 – 00:17:27:04
Agent Palmer
And, and I had an idea and you.
00:17:27:09 – 00:17:27:34
Bill Sweeney
Obtained.
00:17:27:41 – 00:17:37:49
Agent Palmer
It, gotten up. You’ve already gotten a producer credit on the first one, and you’ll get it on all four of these that I do, maybe five. If I do more, I want it.
00:17:37:49 – 00:17:40:06
Bill Sweeney
On the whole frigging show.
00:17:40:11 – 00:17:42:13
Agent Palmer
I give it to you on specific episodes.
00:17:42:17 – 00:17:54:54
Bill Sweeney
All right. Fine. I thought it was like, when you direct, like, the pilot episode of a TV show, you know how, like, you get, like a running credit or like a residual check or some shit for, like, ever? As long as that show’s being made, you’re like, because you helped create.
00:17:55:08 – 00:18:04:12
Agent Palmer
No, but I am trying to I am trying to convince staff to help me book guests by giving her a producer credit on those episodes, or she booked a guest.
00:18:04:17 – 00:18:06:12
Bill Sweeney
That’s what if that’s what it takes.
00:18:06:17 – 00:18:20:59
Agent Palmer
So anyway, the first questionnaire you and I talked through, how it would work. That it ended up on this format, if you like. It is because of Bill. And if you don’t like it, it’s because of me.
00:18:21:04 – 00:18:28:37
Bill Sweeney
Hold on. Well, give it to me. Both ways. I’m willing to take all of the, you know, accolades as easily as all the years.
00:18:28:37 – 00:18:29:56
Agent Palmer
Okay. All right, all right.
00:18:29:56 – 00:18:30:19
Bill Sweeney
You know.
00:18:30:28 – 00:18:31:13
Agent Palmer
But the.
00:18:31:13 – 00:18:34:57
Bill Sweeney
Way you throw tomatoes at me through the internet, folks, give it a shot.
00:18:35:02 – 00:18:37:51
Agent Palmer
Because he really wants to save on his grocery bill.
00:18:38:01 – 00:18:42:59
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, if I can catch it. Although I hate tomatoes. I don’t know. I just make sauce, I guess. Yeah.
00:18:43:04 – 00:18:54:51
Agent Palmer
Yeah. So, three questions are gone, but only three questions are gone. So, Bill, what’s the first one you want to ask me? Of what? Remain?
00:18:54:56 – 00:19:05:38
Bill Sweeney
Well, I, I guess we’re not going to get into too much of trying to break down this whole questionnaire then, like the structuring and all of that, because it’s from, like the 1930s.
00:19:05:43 – 00:19:09:17
Agent Palmer
And then redone in the 70s. Yeah, it’s a whole thing, right?
00:19:09:17 – 00:19:36:23
Bill Sweeney
Right, right, right. Because it’s like some of these questions are like, well, let’s let’s dissect this one. Your favorite occupation. Now this question is this, like the favorite occupation that you’ve had or your favorite occupation that exists out in the world, that for whatever reason, seems to ring some kind of bell for you? Like when when I if I read that flatly, which way do you take that your favorite occupation go.
00:19:36:24 – 00:20:00:32
Agent Palmer
I feel like it is the one I do like the one I’ve done or something. I’ve. My favorite occupation is something that I have actually done. It’s not just as a question that doesn’t sound aspirational. So it’s like, all right, well, if, at face value, there, I will give you the answer that I would not accept if I was you.
00:20:00:32 – 00:20:28:48
Agent Palmer
And then I’ll give you another answer. The answer, the the answer I want to give that I wouldn’t accept is student. Because it feels like, so low stakes. Oh, yeah. I got my paper written, I, I didn’t pass, but I got it written, like, so it’s or like I got a D or whatever. Like the, the stakes are not like you won’t be able to pay your bill next week because you don’t have this paper like, like, so.
00:20:28:53 – 00:20:59:47
Agent Palmer
Yeah, but but we hear that kind of like professional student kind of stuff. I think, with that, established and not counting, I have to go with my current, you know, I get paid to produce and edit podcasts, like, I feel like. Right. That’s my current favorite occupation. And as I’ve talked about on the show, I don’t know if it’s my actual aspirational occupation, but it’s what I have now.
00:21:00:01 – 00:21:00:46
Bill Sweeney
And yeah.
00:21:00:46 – 00:21:14:34
Agent Palmer
Comparing it to everything I’ve ever done, I mean, this is pretty good. I and I, I still kind of don’t believe that this happens. Like I get paid. Not for this show. This shows all.
00:21:14:39 – 00:21:15:29
Bill Sweeney
Yeah. There’s no money here.
00:21:15:31 – 00:21:20:25
Agent Palmer
No money here. And, and and, you know, no budgets. No, no, this is love.
00:21:20:29 – 00:21:21:29
Bill Sweeney
This is love of the game.
00:21:21:29 – 00:21:44:14
Agent Palmer
This is love of the game. But I do get paid to edit other things. And it’s it’s always amazing and it’s always surprising. And if I’m being honest, Bill, especially given our history, I don’t know that I would have picked me as the one to make money in this industry. Out of everyone in our entire circuit.
00:21:44:19 – 00:22:05:02
Bill Sweeney
Fair point. But I will say that like, you know, you were kind of like, well, it may not have been like a thing. I was, like shooting for, but it was always a thing you kind of wanted to do. Like, you know, I think you knew that enough to know that, like, oh, it’d be fun to do that or be fun to have that on the side.
00:22:05:02 – 00:22:29:07
Bill Sweeney
But, like, I don’t know if there’s a career there for me. So maybe you weren’t really chasing that because the pragmatic and logical part of you probably was like, hey, that’d be fun to do. And you were doing it within your own context and your safety net of helping friends and doing your own thing. Yeah. So like to say that you kind of got an offer, fell into whatever, you know what I mean.
00:22:29:16 – 00:22:52:44
Bill Sweeney
However, like you want to phrase that it transpired, but the fact that like you’re doing it, you know. Yeah, I mean, that’s cool as hell. I mean, like, I think that’s what anybody wants to be able to say that they’re doing, you know what I mean? Is that like, okay, like I enjoy the work I do, like even if it’s not glamorous, even if it’s not sexy, even if it’s not crazy high paying, it’s like, you know.
00:22:52:44 – 00:22:52:57
Bill Sweeney
Yeah.
00:22:52:59 – 00:22:55:56
Agent Palmer
I mean, and see now. So, to.
00:22:55:57 – 00:22:57:01
Bill Sweeney
Minimize burnout.
00:22:57:07 – 00:23:15:20
Agent Palmer
As you’ve been talking, I’m like, yeah, but I haven’t done I wrote about it on the blog at one point, but like at that job I had at Arthur Treacher’s was really good. And part of that, again, that that’s just fast food. So it’s not different than any other fast.
00:23:15:20 – 00:23:17:44
Bill Sweeney
Food, but it’s not. It was a good job. It was like you had fun.
00:23:17:51 – 00:23:49:04
Agent Palmer
And yeah, it was the people, right. Like it was. And so there is that as well. But I think what I’m doing now is probably tops on my list. Bill, before I ask you for an answer, of your yourself, like, how do you take this question? Like, do you take it as aspirational or, you know, in my life I’ve done these 12 things and this is my favorite occupation.
00:23:49:09 – 00:24:16:15
Bill Sweeney
Well, that’s the thing. Like, I’ve only had a couple different jobs. I’ve been lucky enough that, like, you know, the first part of my working life was working for my parents in a small deli. And then, like, for the last 20 years, working as a warehouse manager, they’ve both been easy, comfortable, minimal stress type jobs. So like, knock on wood, but I wouldn’t I wouldn’t call them.
00:24:16:20 – 00:24:39:17
Bill Sweeney
I would hesitate to use that verbiage to call them favorite occupation. But what other occupations have I had? So like I can’t I, you know, I mean it’s done if because to me occupation implies the middle long term like you do it for a while. So anything I’ve had fun that I got paid for like intermittently like.
00:24:39:28 – 00:24:42:30
Agent Palmer
What if what if I removed money from the equation?
00:24:42:35 – 00:25:01:24
Bill Sweeney
Well, to me, see, that’s how we’re defining occupation, right? Because here’s the thing, right. Because you kind of touched on it before. But one of the things in looking you up about this thing is that, like, I realize that this question occupation can kind of like in the way that they were phrasing it, kind of mean how we use preoccupation.
00:25:01:24 – 00:25:07:18
Bill Sweeney
Right? Like an occupation, in their view, could be painting for the. Oh, so.
00:25:07:18 – 00:25:08:31
Agent Palmer
This thing, this is.
00:25:08:36 – 00:25:09:01
Bill Sweeney
A thing that.
00:25:09:01 – 00:25:11:20
Agent Palmer
Occupies you. Okay.
00:25:11:25 – 00:25:15:00
Bill Sweeney
So like so we’re using it in a vernacular of jobs.
00:25:15:00 – 00:25:22:08
Agent Palmer
Yeah. No it’s okay. So in no. Oh I mean that I mean it changes my answer completely.
00:25:22:21 – 00:25:23:38
Bill Sweeney
Sure. You know what I mean.
00:25:23:38 – 00:25:26:23
Agent Palmer
And so in that way.
00:25:26:27 – 00:25:28:31
Bill Sweeney
A third way if you’re keeping track.
00:25:28:31 – 00:25:32:26
Agent Palmer
Yeah I think, I think the answer is reading.
00:25:32:31 – 00:25:33:05
Bill Sweeney
00:25:33:10 – 00:25:53:28
Agent Palmer
I think that because that seems like even though like you know I got away from it at one point like, but I’ve been back in it for like 20 years now. And I liked it before then. Feels like that’s probably the one constant. So it feels right because I still enjoy I still enjoy doing it.
00:25:53:33 – 00:25:55:02
Bill Sweeney
Yeah.
00:25:55:06 – 00:26:01:33
Agent Palmer
All right. Well then I, I has, I, I know too much about you built like a hazard what you.
00:26:01:34 – 00:26:11:34
Bill Sweeney
Well I already skipped overdoing a bit, so I mean like getting the outright straight up bit I didn’t even do because I forgot about it, but. So I don’t get nervous. I’m not going to.
00:26:11:35 – 00:26:12:22
Agent Palmer
Okay. All right.
00:26:12:22 – 00:26:13:43
Bill Sweeney
But everybody be cool.
00:26:13:43 – 00:26:17:05
Agent Palmer
Yeah, but your favorite preoccupation.
00:26:17:10 – 00:26:38:05
Bill Sweeney
Like, I would have to say it’s, just just anything creative that I’m doing on a whimsy because I don’t chase these things down through enough. But like, when I’m at work, if I get time to doodle, I have a drawing pad there, you know, starting stories and not finishing them. You know, these kinds of things, at least.
00:26:38:05 – 00:26:52:30
Bill Sweeney
At the very least, like, they they tickle that aspect of me, you know, should I be more consistent to follow these things through a little bit? Yeah, sure. You know what I mean. But, you know, I don’t.
00:26:52:30 – 00:26:55:35
Agent Palmer
Know, consistency burnt you out like you did that podcast.
00:26:55:35 – 00:26:56:25
Bill Sweeney
For me.
00:26:56:30 – 00:27:15:39
Agent Palmer
Like, there’s a part of me that I still think back, and I still use you on this show as an example, but, like. And not in a bad way. It’s just like I do wonder, like, would you still be doing it if it was every other week? Like, would you been able to keep going? Because I would never tell you you were burnt out.
00:27:15:44 – 00:27:26:15
Agent Palmer
But having talked to you since all that ended, the grind ended. Oh hell yeah, bill, you were great. You were ground out at like, episode 40.
00:27:26:26 – 00:27:45:35
Bill Sweeney
Like, you know, I was I wouldn’t go that far back, but that’s what I feel like we were. I was just getting to my stride. But like, by 150, by like 125, I was starting to kind of feel a little bit of boredom or a little bit of like, this is getting a little repetitive. I need to do this up somehow.
00:27:45:35 – 00:27:53:37
Bill Sweeney
I need to kind of bring something other in here and, so.
00:27:53:42 – 00:28:04:59
Agent Palmer
Yeah, I mean, look, I’m I’m all for you getting back into the creative arts in a more regular basis. I won’t even take consistent, just regular basis, whatever that means.
00:28:05:03 – 00:28:05:40
Bill Sweeney
00:28:06:23 – 00:28:29:44
Agent Palmer
Because I am a, I don’t even want to say of the bit, but like I’ve read some of your, you haven’t done them in a while, but like the satire when you write it, not when it’s like bouncing off of me or Ed or Uncle Jay or like whatever, but the satire, when you sit down and write it, I love your satire.
00:28:29:49 – 00:28:40:09
Agent Palmer
Well, and I know, I know, you do art too, but like I there’s something very, very I don’t know you. You see my core when you write your own, whether when you write that satire and I just.
00:28:40:09 – 00:29:02:46
Bill Sweeney
All right. Well that’s that’s I, I, I appreciate hearing that because, Yeah. Yeah. That brings me to the two great tastes together. You know, that’s my chocolate and peanut butter right there. It’s like me being silly and me writing something that’s like, creatively fun and interesting. Like what I mean. And I don’t get the opportunity to do it as much anymore.
00:29:02:50 – 00:29:17:06
Bill Sweeney
And to be honest with you, the fact that you say it surprises me a little bit to to specify into satire or like comedic stuff because like, generally speaking, probably didn’t do as much of that as, like, I would want to know.
00:29:17:06 – 00:29:17:28
Agent Palmer
I think.
00:29:17:28 – 00:29:20:54
Bill Sweeney
You just sort of the parameters of the podcast and stuff like, I think.
00:29:20:55 – 00:29:25:59
Agent Palmer
I think it was maybe once a year on the blog, if that, towards the end.
00:29:26:04 – 00:29:45:44
Bill Sweeney
Like we helped out Jay and Grant for pod Tober Fest, there was probably more comedy things going on there in the process because it was like we kind of come up with bits. Yeah, and segments. So like maybe that’s where like, you got some of the first exposure to that, you know what I mean? Yeah.
00:29:45:49 – 00:29:57:32
Agent Palmer
Yeah. And, and I heard some of the pitches like I and I promised I wouldn’t do this, but I’d do it anyway, like, I, I gave you crap for like four years about the cat post you were going to do.
00:29:57:43 – 00:30:01:46
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, that was a good idea too. And having I was having trouble finding a deal and I’m.
00:30:01:55 – 00:30:06:58
Agent Palmer
And I’m not going to tell anybody about it in case it works because the reveal on the cat post, it.
00:30:06:58 – 00:30:07:55
Bill Sweeney
Was just.
00:30:08:00 – 00:30:10:58
Agent Palmer
Like it was just chef’s kiss. But like that. That was.
00:30:10:59 – 00:30:13:59
Bill Sweeney
A cool. It was all about cool cats. We can just leave it at that. Yeah.
00:30:14:08 – 00:30:28:18
Agent Palmer
But like just just knowing that some of the bits like maybe that’s kind of where like time makes it fuzzy because like yeah, yeah. Not a lot of it made it to the public. But like I knew about it and I was like, yeah, this is really good.
00:30:28:22 – 00:30:52:07
Bill Sweeney
And I always tell you that’s why I’m envious of like, you know, you being able to stay on track and put out, you know, your written stuff on a regular basis. You know, I mean, don’t get me wrong. Like, I can certainly see how, like, this is not to not the creativity that that takes. But, you know, generally speaking, like, you know, you’re writing like reviews and, almost kind of like reactionary pieces.
00:30:52:07 – 00:30:57:59
Bill Sweeney
Yeah. You know, where it doesn’t, it’s a different muscle to flex, you know what I mean?
00:30:57:59 – 00:31:22:32
Agent Palmer
I need to get I in fact, it’s so much a different muscle to flex that supportive. Who will be a guest in the future? For these questions as well. He he’s like, how come you haven’t written any poetry in a while? And Steph’s like, how come you don’t write me any poetry? I heard you used to write poetry, and it’s like I just it.
00:31:22:34 – 00:31:23:17
Bill Sweeney
You’re in trouble.
00:31:23:20 – 00:31:30:00
Agent Palmer
No, I’m not, I’m not in trouble. But, like, I, I do occasionally try and, like, get there.
00:31:30:05 – 00:31:30:23
Bill Sweeney
00:31:30:26 – 00:31:44:08
Agent Palmer
And I feel like mentally or like, skill wise, like on, like a daddy skill tree. Like I have put some time into it, but, like, I don’t even know how to access that, that anymore. It’s the.
00:31:44:08 – 00:32:07:17
Bill Sweeney
Same way with poetry. Like, I feel like that was a young man’s game. Almost. Yeah. Like, actually, there was something about me back then that was more in tuned and inclined, to also not feel so like, like I would just do that. Well, it’s not what’s like I kind of think about it or find a reason and what’s hitting me, you know what I mean?
00:32:07:17 – 00:32:19:55
Bill Sweeney
No. What’s the thing? Oh, like nothing ever comes across my path as a thing to write a poem about, you know, whereas back in the days, like, it would just come out of me and usually, don’t get me wrong, it was because I was all love sick or some shit.
00:32:20:10 – 00:32:45:31
Agent Palmer
Hey, but we. But you know what? For? I would argue mainly because, I’ve been going through it for, another episode of this show. Because why not, use embarrassing stuff? Because it probably makes a good podcast. But like, for every lovesick poem or love or like romantic poem, like there were other things like that was only 50% of everything I wrote.
00:32:45:31 – 00:33:13:15
Agent Palmer
I would argue most of us, in hindsight, remember the lovey crap stuff because we still kind of remembered the bad relationship or the one that got away or whatever, like, but like go through those notebooks if you can. I guarantee you there’s at least 50% of like, just like that kind of either, descriptive or like, I don’t know, it was a, a moonlit night and it was warm, you know, like, just.
00:33:13:20 – 00:33:18:34
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, you you’d probably surprised yourself by what you find. Yeah. If not the whole poem, but parts of it.
00:33:18:34 – 00:33:36:30
Agent Palmer
But at the same time, you say it’s a young man’s game and I go like, I don’t like I, I you really it’s, I feel like it’s probably more like a muscle than anything else. Like if you haven’t done it a long time and I’m trying to get back into it just because I’d like to write other things.
00:33:36:35 – 00:33:40:50
Bill Sweeney
Right? I mean, don’t get me wrong. Like there are professional writers of poetry, but.
00:33:40:50 – 00:33:44:16
Agent Palmer
They’ve been doing they didn’t. But for 20 years, 3030.
00:33:44:28 – 00:34:05:21
Bill Sweeney
I can’t see Maya Angelou and say, yeah, it’s a young it’s a young person’s game. She’s like, I’ve been writing it forever, kid. Like it? I mean, like, yeah, absolutely. It’s it’s a, it’s it’s one of those things either like, you know, if you don’t stick with it, maybe like when you go back to it, it doesn’t feel quite right or something, you know, but it’s a bring it back around.
00:34:05:21 – 00:34:09:01
Bill Sweeney
I mean, that’s the kind of stuff though, that like,
00:34:09:06 – 00:34:10:54
Agent Palmer
That’s what you want to be preoccupied with?
00:34:10:56 – 00:34:33:42
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, just creative chases because, like, let’s look at like this. Like, there’s plenty of things I’ll get into that are more into that. Like, there’s no reason for me to daydream. Like, basically like fanfic of a TV show that I like that will never go this way, never go down a certain path or whatever.
00:34:33:50 – 00:34:34:09
Agent Palmer
Okay.
00:34:34:24 – 00:34:43:00
Bill Sweeney
But my brain will chase that idea down. Okay. And I feel and I feel compelled because, like, I’m stuck on it for two days to just at least committed to a document.
00:34:43:02 – 00:34:44:41
Agent Palmer
Get it, get it out, get it out.
00:34:44:46 – 00:35:12:08
Bill Sweeney
You know, I’m not going to sell Netflix, a mini series. They live that connects all the dots and answers questions that the movie from 1980, whatever leaves unresolved. Because the movie didn’t bother answering questions that it didn’t want to bother. But I sat there one day and watched it, and I was like, oh, yeah, you know, if you kind of did it today, daddy, yada yada, you could do it like this.
00:35:12:08 – 00:35:26:06
Bill Sweeney
You could make it a series. You could answer this question. You can answer that question. Where did the sunglasses come from? Who was making the sunglasses? And then all suddenly was contact lenses in the third eye arc in the in the third act, like, what is this?
00:35:26:17 – 00:35:31:11
Agent Palmer
All right. Before somebody else steals this and and sells it to Netflix, I’m just going to.
00:35:31:11 – 00:35:38:55
Bill Sweeney
Make sure I’m not the only one who notices that there are unanswered questions, too. They live the rowdy Roddy Piper epic.
00:35:39:06 – 00:35:44:48
Agent Palmer
Let’s let’s let’s move on. Let’s move off of occupations and preoccupations.
00:35:44:53 – 00:35:45:17
Bill Sweeney
Okay.
00:35:45:17 – 00:35:50:26
Agent Palmer
To whatever what’s question to
00:35:50:31 – 00:36:07:24
Bill Sweeney
And I don’t know which way this is going to go, but it just seemed to stick. And keep in mind, like for me, like these questions that I picked Will because like, well, some of the, the other questions were just kind of like, I don’t know, like, I know these are supposed to be like interview questions, but like, they just didn’t feel like that.
00:36:07:27 – 00:36:31:44
Bill Sweeney
Okay. So so I ended up here with these, but your idea of happiness, which, you know, I’m not as like, had some mental gymnastics go on as I did with the previous question. You know, this one seemed pretty straightforward, but, it just it just it just seemed like one, that maybe there was something there for you.
00:36:31:47 – 00:36:32:20
Bill Sweeney
You know, it’s.
00:36:32:20 – 00:36:54:02
Agent Palmer
One of those. It’s it’s one of the few. Maybe not for you. I feel like if I really wanted to, I could make every single one of these be about like. Well, I probably have a different answer. Before I had the kid. Yeah, right. You know, and I don’t I don’t say that lightly, but like, obviously it’s a monumental life thing.
00:36:54:07 – 00:37:22:43
Agent Palmer
But I don’t. So this is this is going to sound bad. But, you know, I am I’m a pessimist. I don’t spend a lot of time in joy. I’m working on that. Like, you know what I mean? Like, I’m taking the time, with a newborn or, well, infant, I guess soon enough, he’ll be a toddler.
00:37:22:43 – 00:37:45:39
Agent Palmer
Like, it goes quick. Like when people say it goes quick. Like, I think part of it is it goes quick, and part of it is like, days have no meaning. And then all of a sudden, it’s two months later. But like, I only bring it up because, you know, in the last episode with Chris, I talked about one of my faults being that I don’t celebrate things.
00:37:45:44 – 00:37:46:18
Bill Sweeney
00:37:46:23 – 00:38:25:27
Agent Palmer
And so there’s this thing where my idea of happiness is, or at least was, I guess it still is. Is is something that you talked about when it came to the preoccupation part. I think that being in the flow for whatever it is. Right. Like whether I’m playing guitar, writing something, editing something, having a conversation, like recording it no matter what, like when I’m in the zone, the flow, when it’s going, it feels effortless.
00:38:25:32 – 00:38:50:17
Agent Palmer
That’s that’s the moment. Like that’s that’s the best. And so a lot of that has to do with the act of creation because a lot of the time and anybody who’s ever tried to create anything or anybody who’s ever been to school knows this, there are essays that take you hours to write even 500 words.
00:38:50:17 – 00:38:55:14
Agent Palmer
And then there are things that you write in like 500 words in five minutes.
00:38:55:19 – 00:38:55:46
Bill Sweeney
That.
00:38:55:57 – 00:39:19:42
Agent Palmer
Second one, that’s the flow. That’s like, I’ve got it. Like, I know where I’m going. I’m not I’m not thinking too fast for my hands to type or write. I’m at the same. Like I’m getting it out. And then when I’m done, I’m done. Oh my God, I can’t believe I did that. And those moments when you’re in them, they feel amazing because you feel almost invincible.
00:39:19:46 – 00:39:44:52
Agent Palmer
Yeah. And at the moment, like, yeah, when, when when little Palmer looks at me and smiles like it is happiness. But at the same time, for the last 40 plus years, if I could write something in no time flat without thinking about it, and it just pours out of me, that’s been like the essence of happiness for me.
00:39:44:57 – 00:40:05:45
Agent Palmer
And it might be one of the reasons why I don’t celebrate 100 or 400 or the round numbers. I don’t take time to look back because I’m always on like a I’m basically addicted to creating, right? And so I’m always writing the next blog post in the hope that the next one will be five minutes, 1500 words.
00:40:05:45 – 00:40:10:17
Agent Palmer
And I don’t know where it came. And I read it and they go, oh my God, this is amazing.
00:40:10:22 – 00:40:30:50
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, I think I kind of have to agree with you for my answer, you know, to this because, you know, hearing you say it, it’s echoing stuff that I’ve said before, and I really didn’t have, like a clear cut answer for this question anyway. And I kind of look at it back in my head, thought, it’s going to sound like a lot like probably my answer for the first one.
00:40:30:50 – 00:40:56:08
Bill Sweeney
But, I have to agree with you. You gave good examples of it, but the flow state stuff of making a thing and like having the instant clarity that comes in the beginning of it, like, oh, I know exactly what that is. I know, I know what top to bottom, straight through. And if I jump on it right now, I think I’m going to pound it out.
00:40:56:13 – 00:41:21:04
Bill Sweeney
And I’ve done it a handful of times. And compared to other times when I very similar kind of had a very clear vision, but maybe not all the way through to the end point. Okay, unlikely. Like I on a on a creative writing or something like that. But to see the trajectory of it, stick with it, chase it down.
00:41:21:09 – 00:41:22:44
Agent Palmer
And finish like that, I.
00:41:22:46 – 00:41:23:18
Bill Sweeney
Think finish.
00:41:23:22 – 00:41:25:15
Agent Palmer
I think that’s the so I remember.
00:41:25:19 – 00:41:26:13
Bill Sweeney
00:41:27:54 – 00:41:57:55
Agent Palmer
In college I wrote a short story in that same flurry. Right. However I didn’t have an end. It just kind of ends right. Like the flow state ended and the short story ended where that it did. And who, who hasn’t who, whoever. It’s been a creative in their free time who hasn’t done this? I was in a writing class and I was like, they’re like, hey, you need to write a short story.
00:41:57:55 – 00:42:01:14
Agent Palmer
And I was like, well, I’ve got this one. Like, I’ll dig this one out.
00:42:01:19 – 00:42:02:52
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, and I could that’s how that goes.
00:42:02:52 – 00:42:20:03
Agent Palmer
I couldn’t come up with a better ending than just the way my flow state ended. And so I presented it to the class and like, you get feedback. And I had like, 30 of the, like, 20 people in the class, like there were 14 different interpretations.
00:42:20:08 – 00:42:21:17
Bill Sweeney
Yeah. Of the end.
00:42:21:22 – 00:42:32:33
Agent Palmer
And I was like, well, these are all kind of good. And it’s like, God, I wish that Flow State had lasted just a bit longer, and I would have actually ended on my own terms, because right now it’s like, I don’t, I don’t know.
00:42:32:38 – 00:42:54:21
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, like you can come up with an ambiguous ending sometimes for like a short story thing where it’s just like, wait, that doesn’t I don’t know if that’s satisfying, but it I could end it right here. Well, and it would just be one of those type of stories, like what I mean. And I guess that is where I ended because I don’t have anything past this point.
00:42:54:21 – 00:43:09:35
Bill Sweeney
Yeah. So okay, so that’s like, you know, I know you don’t read Stephen King stuff, but, you know, his short stories are great, but so many of his short stories were like churned out back in the days. And he would sell them off to magazines. And some of them have like, solid banger endings.
00:43:09:39 – 00:43:09:58
Agent Palmer
Okay.
00:43:09:58 – 00:43:20:03
Bill Sweeney
But a lot of them have like it’s ambiguous, like. And then the bad man smiled and Jimmy knew that this was the end of everything.
00:43:20:08 – 00:43:21:52
Agent Palmer
And then it ends and then it’s done.
00:43:22:03 – 00:43:35:52
Bill Sweeney
So that’s it. That’s the end. It’s like, oh, what does that mean? It’s like, how is that an ending? What happens to Jimmy like the next? Like he just met the bad man and now they’re in the same room and it’s like, you know, well, no, no, no, man, it’s just it is what it is. But like. Yeah.
00:43:35:52 – 00:44:10:00
Bill Sweeney
So like when I’ve had those moments where it’s like, oh no, no, no, no, I did have an ending for I and I stayed true. And through the project. Yeah. And then got some kind of validation for it in that like apropos of like getting into details like, oh, it was kind of like a, an internet based group project and like get really good feedback from other people or like, you know, like seem and genuine, genuine feedback and praise to like, hey, this is good.
00:44:10:00 – 00:44:23:40
Bill Sweeney
This is a good idea. Like, you know, I had some people tell me a couple things. They were like, you should just keep this for yourself, bro. Like, I don’t know why you’re serious. You could make this a novel series. Why are you sharing this here? Like, keep this for yourself. You know, the question. Is your idea of happiness?
00:44:23:42 – 00:44:42:01
Bill Sweeney
Is it like, you know, the question is. It’s like. It’s kind of like, tilted to, like, defining, like what happiness is like. It’s some more esoteric kind of way as opposed to just like, how do you where do you find it? What has like, made you the most fulfilled kind of things?
00:44:42:01 – 00:44:56:56
Agent Palmer
And yeah, well, I think that you and I are the most jilted people to answer this question, because while you don’t necessarily create like you want to, you still have a want and a need to even if you don’t fulfill that.
00:44:57:07 – 00:44:57:30
Bill Sweeney
Yeah.
00:44:57:43 – 00:45:22:01
Agent Palmer
And I still have a want and need and do fulfill that. And yet the reason that you and I continue to want and need to is because we’re still searching for that thing, right? Like that. If if we were completely I think this is true of all artists. If you were completely happy and fulfilled, you wouldn’t have to create the thing that, like full stop period.
00:45:22:01 – 00:45:45:04
Agent Palmer
Like, I mean, yeah, it’s a little bit laid out on the couch and let’s talk about it. But like, at the same time. Yeah, I feel like that’s what I’m like. That’s why I think like, okay, well that’s why sometimes I, that’s why I still have my, my old journals because like some of those flow states exist in there and it’s like, well I keep them around because like maybe I can like maybe I can figure it out.
00:45:45:04 – 00:46:05:38
Agent Palmer
Like, obviously not the case. Like, you need that lightning in a bottle and there’s no nothing else. It is. That’s exactly what it is. It’s a needle in a haystack. Like, whatever. All the cliches, like, that’s what that flow state is. And maybe that’s why that’s the reason. It’s like the true happiness. Because like, you don’t get it all the time and you have to work for it.
00:46:05:38 – 00:46:12:14
Agent Palmer
And sometimes it just appears in front of you and you have to grab it. And sometimes, like, you’re not going to see it for a few years.
00:46:12:19 – 00:46:31:49
Bill Sweeney
Yeah. You just have to like, write it out. Like when that instinct kind of just happens where it’s like your brain just kind of starts to put all the pieces together and sort of you kind of subconsciously recognizes that’s what this is. Just do it. Then, like, you know, you’re kind of a fool to not. Yeah, not I mean, and well.
00:46:31:49 – 00:46:44:07
Agent Palmer
And those of us who have known it like we’re even worse because we’re like, if it if like, we’ll take it, it feels like it might be a flow state.
00:46:44:12 – 00:46:45:22
Bill Sweeney
You know what I mean? Like.
00:46:45:27 – 00:46:51:05
Agent Palmer
Yeah, we’ll take a swing at something. It’s like, oh, I was like ten minutes later, you’re like that. Nope.
00:46:51:05 – 00:47:01:35
Bill Sweeney
Not not it. No. Oh yeah, I thought I had something here. Yeah. And it’s like now you had the opening four lines. That’s, that’s that’s about it.
00:47:01:35 – 00:47:02:47
Agent Palmer
That’s all you get. Yeah.
00:47:02:47 – 00:47:09:48
Bill Sweeney
It’s all you had kid. It’s a cool it’s a cool setup, those four lines. But that’s you you know.
00:47:09:58 – 00:47:11:01
Agent Palmer
Can you need a little bit more.
00:47:11:01 – 00:47:13:49
Bill Sweeney
Yeah I’m getting a little bit more. You’re going to have to chase it down.
00:47:13:54 – 00:47:16:38
Agent Palmer
All right. So let’s, let’s go on to number three.
00:47:16:43 – 00:47:32:29
Bill Sweeney
So that’s one I kind of feel like I probably know what some of these answers are going to be okay, only because I just I just know you now. Okay. Well, favorite heroes in fiction?
00:47:32:34 – 00:47:43:00
Agent Palmer
In fiction, I like, I, I like this question. Like, I saw it and I was like, I’m not going to think about this one. And I was like, but I wonder how long it’s going to last because it’s.
00:47:43:14 – 00:47:45:17
Bill Sweeney
Way to not come prepared, I guess.
00:47:45:31 – 00:48:09:43
Agent Palmer
Well, no, that was the whole reason. Like, I don’t I think, I think a lot of these questions, it’s again, it’s like ask me next week if I don’t come prepared. Like it might be different. Yeah. But in fiction, you know, there’s a, there’s definitely a few, you know, I think the most modern one is probably Tony Stark.
00:48:09:48 – 00:48:40:54
Agent Palmer
The most modern one. Sure. And I think that I don’t know for anybody keeping score, it’s not Iron Man, it’s Tony Stark. There’s a distinction because his arc into especially Iron Man three, which is a movie most people hate, but I love because it kind of really, it I was seeing myself on the screen through his, post-traumatic stress.
00:48:40:54 – 00:48:54:36
Agent Palmer
Anxiety? Yeah, stuff. And it’s like, oh, no, like he’s still trying to go through it. And, you know, that panic attack at the beginning of that movie might be the most real thing I’ve ever seen in the Marvel Cinematic Universe, right?
00:48:54:41 – 00:48:56:23
Bill Sweeney
Two relatable. Yeah.
00:48:56:28 – 00:49:02:04
Agent Palmer
Like like I remember being in the theater going like this has to end before I have a panic attack, right?
00:49:02:04 – 00:49:03:02
Bill Sweeney
Right.
00:49:03:07 – 00:49:28:19
Agent Palmer
Beyond that, though, you know, I, I do absolutely love, you know, Tolkien’s universe, but there’s not any one there where I’m like, oh, this is the best. I’d like it to be like, I think for the memes, even before this was a thing like Tom Bombadil would have been like an answer when I was much younger.
00:49:28:24 – 00:49:59:22
Agent Palmer
Sure. But I know that that’s, that’s just for the funny. That’s not serious. Right? Right. There is this, there are a couple characters and their fleeting. And I haven’t reread those books enough, and I haven’t seen them in mediums. I know that at least one of them exists in another medium, which are from Clive Barker’s fantasy, stuff.
00:49:59:27 – 00:50:11:20
Agent Palmer
Specifically, there’s a couple characters in Galilee and, the great and secret show that are like. All right, so some of this stuff is really cool.
00:50:11:25 – 00:50:12:31
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:50:12:38 – 00:50:38:38
Agent Palmer
And it’s like, I feel like maybe it’s because of the way Barker writes these people with. I don’t want to say like, unlimited power, but they feel like the genie from Aladdin. And yet almost all the people he writes with that kind of power never abuse it. And that’s like, that always stuck with me.
00:50:38:43 – 00:50:40:44
Bill Sweeney
For two reasons. Well, okay.
00:50:40:49 – 00:50:56:28
Agent Palmer
One, it would have been very easy for him to write different, completely different novels if they abused that. And two, those novels would not be as memorable if they just were like, well, I can control time, so.
00:50:56:33 – 00:51:22:27
Bill Sweeney
Right, right, right, right. Whatever. Well, that’s the thing with Clive Barker, is that if he’s not writing like the weirdest, borderline depraved type horror, it’s just completely fucking weird. Just like, you know, I mean, so, like, you know, creating a secret show might be one of the few books you and I have in common that we’ve read and, really kind of like, quasi obsessed with,
00:51:22:32 – 00:51:32:02
Agent Palmer
And it’s and it’s to a point where I will add to that saying, like, I, I want to reread it, but I don’t want to reread it.
00:51:32:02 – 00:51:48:40
Bill Sweeney
I got I got halfway through the last time I was trying to reread it, and not for any particular reason, but I do know that I was obsessed. I couldn’t turn it off anyway. I should say. Sometimes with some books I just get like I can’t turn off certain aspects that my brain is doing while I’m reading it, right?
00:51:48:40 – 00:52:10:20
Bill Sweeney
Like, for instance, I finally got around to reading The Shining. The main character is called Jack. He is described, literally. How could they not have cast Jack Nicholson like the first couple of paragraphs where, like, you’re reading about him and how he’s, like, always simmering and feels like a ticking time bomb, basically like, yeah, fucking Jack Nicholson, of course.
00:52:10:25 – 00:52:28:31
Bill Sweeney
But, so, like, I could only like it got distracting. Like I could only see the movie. I could only see Jack Nicholson and like, my brain was doing its just kind of thing. And for Green Secret Shell, my brain was breaking it down into a TV series. I at some point I was like, oh, okay, this is a thing that happens a lot lately.
00:52:28:31 – 00:52:47:57
Bill Sweeney
I’m bringing it up again. But like it was, my brain was breaking it down as a TV series like, oh, this is how you would do this, I guess, right? This is. And then once I that started to happen. Yeah, it was like my brain was on two parallel rails at the same time. Like me digesting the the text on the page and then my brain simultaneously.
00:52:48:02 – 00:52:49:52
Agent Palmer
And this is the end of episode five.
00:52:50:01 – 00:53:13:31
Bill Sweeney
I formatting it in my head like, oh, okay. Yeah, you would probably change that because it’s a little dated now, blah blah blah, like, you know, and this kind of thing. But yeah, like, and you know, I’ll say about the characters in that haven’t read Galileo, but that’s at least in that book, like the good characters are good, but they’re not like, goody good.
00:53:13:36 – 00:53:15:33
Agent Palmer
No, they’re they’re just human angels.
00:53:15:33 – 00:53:38:38
Bill Sweeney
Yeah. They’re not pristine angels. You don’t. I mean, it doesn’t mean, like, they’re anti-heroes or borderline bad guy with a gun. It just means that, like, in other, weirder ways, it’s like, you know, they, fallible and struggling and in a really weird environment, not understanding what the fuck is going on half the time. And that seems relatable.
00:53:38:43 – 00:53:42:35
Bill Sweeney
But, yeah, I think I think I pulled you off the track a little bit.
00:53:42:37 – 00:53:59:13
Agent Palmer
No, no, I, I also think, like, I’m trying to think of, like others, and I just can’t, like, I, I’ve kind of fallen into this like, I think it’s a bit of a rut. Like when people ask about favorites where.
00:53:59:16 – 00:54:00:27
Bill Sweeney
Yeah.
00:54:00:32 – 00:54:24:11
Agent Palmer
When it comes to movies specifically, I just think about, like, was the writing good? And I like, I don’t want to denigrate the actors, but like, I’m just like, that was an amazing story with great dialog. And if you have one of the two of those things, I’m probably in great dialog can save a bad plot. And, a great plot can save bad dialog.
00:54:24:11 – 00:54:28:54
Agent Palmer
But like, that’s kind of how I measure all of it.
00:54:28:58 – 00:54:49:52
Bill Sweeney
Yeah. Because in the end, what you take away is like, well, I know people latch on to like, characters in ways that I don’t quite get, like, you know, every I don’t know, maybe it’s just the internet and we get to see inside everybody else’s frigging brain now. But like, you know, people will just obsess about a particular character and just, you know, and I’m like, yeah, that guy’s good.
00:54:49:52 – 00:55:01:11
Bill Sweeney
But the show, what’s happening around him is equally as interesting as what he does in that environment, or the choices that he makes.
00:55:01:11 – 00:55:25:53
Agent Palmer
There could be an argument to be said that some of this, has to do with the spin off podcast you did, preacher versus preacher, and I don’t mean to be very specific about it, except I do, because you and I and our friends, we dissected shows and maybe it’s to a point of maybe this is just what geeks always did, because obviously you didn’t need a cast to do this.
00:55:26:04 – 00:55:29:51
Agent Palmer
But like, we will talk about the other things.
00:55:29:56 – 00:55:30:55
Bill Sweeney
It’s a book club, you.
00:55:30:55 – 00:55:45:12
Agent Palmer
Know what I mean? Like it is a book club, but it’s also very specific like. Yeah. And so I think maybe part of it is that like we’ve always kind of had this. Yeah, but look at everything else.
00:55:45:17 – 00:55:46:40
Bill Sweeney
Right. Right.
00:55:46:45 – 00:55:51:01
Agent Palmer
Oh my god. Right. Did you see what happened in the background and be like no.
00:55:51:05 – 00:56:02:50
Bill Sweeney
Well it’s like David and Goliath, right? Like we don’t know any off the top of your head. What do you know about David? Is he that David? I don’t I don’t know, but it’s like a folklore or. It’s like a story. But you know what he did? Why is it.
00:56:02:50 – 00:56:18:36
Agent Palmer
That every time you talk, I see another show? It’s like David. Goliath. But this David is not that David. Goliath? Is that Goliath? But this David’s like some accountant from down the road that like, just whatever. And like, people like, oh, it’s great that you slew Goliath. And he’s like, that wasn’t me.
00:56:18:43 – 00:56:34:47
Bill Sweeney
I’m David Byrne, Burlington or something. You’re looking for David Marshall. Like, you know. Right? Right, right, right. Exactly. You know exactly that. That would be the twist. That would be the twist on a modern day show. That is actually the twist on my Diff’rent Strokes fucking remake. But let’s not get into that where, like, this is what.
00:56:34:47 – 00:56:37:12
Agent Palmer
Happens, though, when you and I get together older.
00:56:37:15 – 00:56:41:13
Bill Sweeney
Willis would not the real Arnold and Willis? They were like two other kids.
00:56:41:17 – 00:56:53:37
Agent Palmer
When you were, like, together. This is what happens, I think. I think because our friendship started with the collaboration on something, right? We’re like, oh, and then the pitch machine just starts up.
00:56:53:42 – 00:57:26:52
Bill Sweeney
Just it just goes. It’s just we’re not even touching the throttle, but the lever went over on its own. Yeah, yeah yeah yeah, yeah. But yeah man. Because it’s like, well, here’s the thing with the heroes in fiction, right? Especially I think nowadays it’s like, I think this is why certain things work better than others. It’s like we were just saying we’re like, if that story in that world isn’t as dynamically interesting or just on par with that great character.
00:57:27:07 – 00:57:35:27
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, then it’s not going to vibe, right? It’s not. It’s going to feel off. Right. So like.
00:57:35:32 – 00:57:37:13
Agent Palmer
Well, hold on like this.
00:57:37:18 – 00:57:56:21
Bill Sweeney
This feels like some like like sci fi original shows. Sometimes I would watch them, I would be like, yes, this this detective is cool and interesting and I like this actor, but everything else around them is kind of like, man, okay, you know, I hope this guy goes on to better. Thanks. Yeah. I mean.
00:57:56:31 – 00:58:02:33
Agent Palmer
So what would who is your favorite hero in fiction?
00:58:02:38 – 00:58:09:22
Bill Sweeney
I guess sometimes it probably would depend on, like, how you define heroes. Okay, but I’m not.
00:58:09:22 – 00:58:11:19
Agent Palmer
Saying the good guy, but let’s say main character.
00:58:11:23 – 00:58:46:12
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but, well, jeez, my brain just started going further down the rabbit hole of like, well, which heroes? All of the Marvel Universe because you would call books growing up. You know what I mean? But, so you mentioned preacher. That was like an important book to me. But, Jesse is a bit of a more modern lens, is not the greatest guy, but, super complicated.
00:58:46:21 – 00:58:52:59
Bill Sweeney
Yeah. You know, and actually makes bad decisions and stuff like that.
00:58:52:59 – 00:58:59:44
Agent Palmer
So, and, and, and maybe more important, there are consequences to those bad decisions.
00:58:59:49 – 00:59:07:47
Bill Sweeney
Okay. Well, that’s that’s one of the few books that feels like when the consequences come back around, they are.
00:59:08:01 – 00:59:09:48
Agent Palmer
Oh, they come back around. Yeah.
00:59:09:48 – 00:59:45:27
Bill Sweeney
They are equal then multiplied as in good fiction. They probably should always be, you know, but outside of him, there aren’t many that kind of linger for me in a ways, maybe for some other people, but, because it like, you know, like all the Stephen King I’ve read, the only one that really stands out is, one of the boys from Eyes of the Dragon, which, if you don’t know the book, it’s like, it’s a medieval fantasy, like, young adults kind of thing that Stephen King wrote for his, for his daughter.
00:59:45:27 – 00:59:59:27
Bill Sweeney
Really? I don’t know if or how true it is, but supposedly he was, you know, telling her the story at night. It was like, yeah, I should write this fucking down or, it was just kind of like a thing that came to his head. Like, I don’t have anything that my kids could read.
00:59:59:39 – 01:00:00:16
Agent Palmer
Okay.
01:00:00:21 – 01:00:19:51
Bill Sweeney
You know, that kind of a thing. So it’s a medieval fantasy. King dies. There’s two sons. The older one is blamed for it, but the older one is only like 14. His little brother’s like 9 or 10. So the 9 or 10 year old becomes king because his brother, who gets blamed for the murder, ends up locked in a castle in a high steeple.
01:00:19:55 – 01:01:01:46
Bill Sweeney
But that older brother, Peter, despite being locked up in the steeple and like having everything taken away from him, stays positive, finds his ways to work out from up there how to get out and what’s really going on down below, and uses some kind of like ingenious. He kind of like things to get himself out of the situation and like, really kind of rises to the top of, of a thing where like at first you kind of feel like, oh, this is we’re not going to spend any time with that character.
01:01:01:46 – 01:01:23:46
Bill Sweeney
He’s gonna be locked up there the whole time. But it’s like, no, no, you spend a good amount of time getting in his head and and how he, you know, his, his head works and stuff like that. And so in that, he’s kind of like a different kind of his heroism is, is just not giving up. You know, it’s up there for years, trapped and locked away.
01:01:23:51 – 01:01:26:37
Agent Palmer
Do you feel like you’re trapped in a castle?
01:01:26:42 – 01:01:40:26
Bill Sweeney
Listen, buddy, if we’re going to start psychoanalyzing me now, we’re going to be here a lot.
01:01:40:31 – 01:02:04:02
Agent Palmer
For a long time, I was the one helping Bill. And now, as the credits to this series of episodes can attest, Bill is now helping me with stuff. This time is a credit to the executive producer. This is a change for us, but it’s great. One of the reasons that Bill and I are still friends, and we may have spoken about this during the friendship episode, is collaboration with his podcast on some kind of semi-permanent break.
01:02:04:02 – 01:02:26:40
Agent Palmer
Mine’s the only one going, and so if we’re going to collaborate, it’s going to be on some of the hypothetical pitches he mentioned in this episode, or the ones that happen when we talk on the phone, or it’s going to be something to do with this podcast. We started our friendship. No. Before that, our knowing each other as collaborators, and it’s what we love to do, even if nothing comes to fruition.
01:02:26:40 – 01:02:48:11
Agent Palmer
It’s like practice. So when these things come down for real, when this series of episodes was something I spoke with Bill about, we knew the language and how to go about the discussion of pros and cons. For us, an idea is just the beginning, as it should be, and perhaps that’s why we both enjoy creative flow states. Thanks for listening to The Palmer Files episode 155.
01:02:48:11 – 01:03:05:43
Agent Palmer
And now for the official business. The Palmer Files releases every two weeks on Tuesdays. If you’re still listening, I encourage you to join the discussion. You can find all related ways to contact us in the show notes, Bill’s podcasts, the Wicked Theory Podcast, and maybe even preacher Versus Preacher or the DC TV report are still available at this time.
01:03:05:43 – 01:03:25:03
Agent Palmer
But Wicked theory.com is where you can see all of his endeavors and where he does still post on rare occasions. You should check it out. Bill Sweeney was an executive producer for this episode. The music for this episode was provided by Henno Heitur. Email and comments can be sent to this show at The Palmer Files at gmail.com. And remember, you’re home for all things.
01:03:25:03 – 01:03:45:39
Agent Palmer
Agent Palmer is Agent palmer.com.
01:03:45:44 – 01:03:52:07
Agent Palmer
See?
01:03:52:12 – 01:04:12:26
Agent Palmer
You.
01:04:12:31 – 01:04:30:07
Agent Palmer
All right, Bill, I have a question for you. And you kind of talked about it a little bit, but like or we touched on it. This was a game in the 70s. What would you be all right with like like if, if for episode 200 as a celebration, we were like, all right. Like, here’s the here’s the question.
01:04:30:21 – 01:04:34:24
Agent Palmer
Like, let’s just ask each other questions.
01:04:34:29 – 01:04:52:10
Bill Sweeney
Like, as is just like these questions. Yeah. You know, maybe these questions aren’t good enough. Like, I need them to be a little bit more dynamic, or at least like, let people kind of, bend them around a little bit.
01:04:52:21 – 01:04:52:53
Agent Palmer
I gotcha.
01:04:53:06 – 01:05:10:23
Bill Sweeney
You know, but I mean, it’s not to say fun can’t be had and surprising answers can’t come out of it all. I mean, like, don’t get me wrong, going into this today, I was like, I don’t know, how did I pick are these going to be good questions? Is this going to be interesting? Is this kind of have any fun to it?
01:05:10:23 – 01:05:13:16
Bill Sweeney
Like, you know, I mean, like, a problem as if.
01:05:13:16 – 01:05:16:05
Agent Palmer
You and I don’t have fun every time we get on the mic.
01:05:16:18 – 01:05:21:10
Bill Sweeney
Right, right. But also, hey, that’s what I do, right? I kind of overthink it a little bit.
01:05:21:14 – 01:05:23:10
Agent Palmer
I told you I wouldn’t put you on the couch.
01:05:23:15 – 01:05:28:16
Bill Sweeney
That’s true. Juju. It’s all right. I’m going to fall asleep. If you put me on the couch.
01:05:28:21 – 01:05:31:23
Agent Palmer
All right, so you have one final question for me.
01:05:31:28 – 01:05:49:14
Bill Sweeney
I do, I do, I guess I just don’t know who else to ask, right? I mean, I think I kind of know the answer, but let’s get someone else’s opinion. So, like, you know, when you’re watching, like, interviews other, other interviews and, the person being interviewed, like, a lot of times they’ll go, oh, that’s a good question.
01:05:49:14 – 01:05:54:11
Bill Sweeney
Good question. Yeah. Good question. Whoa. What’s going on there?
01:05:54:16 – 01:06:09:05
Agent Palmer
I, I so, okay, I edit a podcast in my day job where occasionally it doesn’t happen often. But we have a questionnaire that’s like the second half of the episodes.
01:06:09:10 – 01:06:09:31
Bill Sweeney
Okay.
01:06:09:40 – 01:06:16:38
Agent Palmer
And it’s like the same batch. There’s like ten questions, but the host will ask seven of them or whatever.
01:06:16:43 – 01:06:17:30
Bill Sweeney
01:06:17:35 – 01:06:40:29
Agent Palmer
And so I’ve heard the guests go, that’s a great question. But not all of them say, that’s a great question to the same question. Right. Like, right. Right. So I am I am a very good person to ask this to. I genuinely believe all of it is wasting time. But for people who genuinely mean that’s a great question.
01:06:40:29 – 01:06:56:15
Agent Palmer
All they’re saying is hold the phone. I’ve never thought of it in that way before. I need a moment. But like there is a part of it that’s like when you hear that sometimes you’re like, that’s a he just asked why?
01:06:56:20 – 01:06:58:22
Bill Sweeney
Like, you know, sometimes it’s like.
01:06:58:35 – 01:07:00:58
Agent Palmer
Oh, what’s your favorite color, bill?
01:07:01:02 – 01:07:22:53
Bill Sweeney
Well, I don’t think that’s a good question at all, but but I get what you’re saying. You’re right. I think you’re right. I think sometimes it’s people are just kind of, like, befuddled or, stunned, stunted by the thing. I think maybe so it’s not. It’s not like, oh, bad question. It’s just like, okay, I gotta think about it for a second.
01:07:22:53 – 01:07:38:13
Bill Sweeney
So they just kind of say, oh, that’s a good question, because that’s the thing you say, because, like, you didn’t have an instant thought as a response. Also, let’s just like you said before, like, oh, no, no, it’s a good question because like, I’ve, I been asked a lot of questions and no one’s ever asked that one. So it’s like.
01:07:38:14 – 01:07:40:04
Agent Palmer
There’s a, there’s a part of me that.
01:07:40:09 – 01:07:44:47
Bill Sweeney
Shut up. Either way, it’s a let me think about it for a second.
01:07:44:51 – 01:07:58:36
Agent Palmer
There’s a part of me that thinks to like, shouldn’t you take the time to think about every answer before? Like, especially in media, like if you have an answer right away, you weren’t listening to the question. I’m sorry.
01:07:58:40 – 01:08:17:39
Bill Sweeney
Well, that’s what’s funny about watching, like, some old interview shows like your Dick Cavett. And then he’d have somebody on and I’d be like, yes, I know that you’re recording a television show, but I’m going to take my sweet time and answering everything, and sometimes they just don’t answer the question right away, you know what I mean? Whereas I think now that’s too media savvy.
01:08:17:39 – 01:08:19:34
Bill Sweeney
And it’s just like, you know, they have to say something.
01:08:19:37 – 01:08:41:59
Agent Palmer
But that’s the thing. So well, okay. But that goes back into our history because the we are in Michigan and you and I and you, myself and Grant are with Steph because Hannah wasn’t around for a very special episode of Gotham Lights.
01:08:42:04 – 01:08:43:01
Bill Sweeney
Right?
01:08:43:05 – 01:08:55:16
Agent Palmer
I got to say three words, because any time Steph or you or even Grant, I love him to death. But any time anybody asked me a question because I was the newest to the show.
01:08:55:21 – 01:08:56:21
Bill Sweeney
01:08:56:26 – 01:09:22:57
Agent Palmer
If I took more than a beat to answer, Grant would fill the space. And I never get back. And so. And look, there are people like Grant in media that like there more radio than anything else. So you have to fill the space. That air is bad air. Yeah. Versus like, I don’t know, there’s a part of me, especially with the old Cavett shows that you bring up.
01:09:22:57 – 01:09:35:29
Agent Palmer
Like, they’ll let it linger. Yeah, they’ll let Bill. They’ll they’ll pan to Dick Cavett looking at the. I’m looking at the guest.
01:09:35:34 – 01:09:36:01
Bill Sweeney
Waiting.
01:09:36:01 – 01:09:44:48
Agent Palmer
Waiting. And it’s like, this is I know it doesn’t sound like gripping television, but it’s better than half the stuff that’s on now.
01:09:44:59 – 01:10:04:18
Bill Sweeney
Yeah, yeah. And now they wouldn’t. If that happened, they would just edit it down, you know? I mean, at least, you know, in the old days or more so they would let it linger and it was like leave it in because of the vibe, you know, that of the era or that show itself, you know what I mean?
01:10:04:18 – 01:10:17:43
Bill Sweeney
But it was like, you know, it was much more leisurely laid back and, you know, whereas everything now is a machine. We got to go, go, go go go. We got we got you here for seven minutes. Tell an anecdote and get the fuck out, you know.
01:10:17:44 – 01:10:30:23
Agent Palmer
Well, I’ll say this. No one’s ever said that’s a great question, Palmer. Oh, shit. So now. So now I have something to be aspirational for.
01:10:30:28 – 01:10:37:09
Bill Sweeney
You get it? Fucking. Are you going to have to market down your calendar? You can’t even then be like, finally got it, folks. You know.
01:10:37:09 – 01:10:47:27
Agent Palmer
Or or maybe it’ll just be one of those things that you never get. Like, you never get to the end of the rainbow. It’s fine. So I clearly I’m just not that good at this.
01:10:47:31 – 01:10:50:08
Bill Sweeney
Damn it.
01:10:50:13 – 01:10:52:16
Bill Sweeney
One day, maybe.
–End Transcription–
This transcription was processed by PalmerTech 3.1 and may contain errors for HUMINT (human intelligence).